I had some spare time at work today so I figured out precisely how buffs work. I made some other posts about it so I'm just going to consolidate them here in a place where people can see them.

We know already from testing that for AoE healing the buff adds 20% of defense as healing.

So, let's take my +5 and +5 lak and do some testing, shall we?!

I'll give you guys the correct answer ahead of time and then show my work - here is the punchline, so to speak.

First thing to test is to do heals with 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc buffs.

Rebecca heal with x buffs

0 buffs = 218

1 buff = 259

2 buffs = 300

3 buffs = 342

Another interesting thing to notice is that EVERY TIME the healing is increased by *exactly* 41 (well, 42 the third time but that's decimal point carryover or just the extra 285.75 armor adding up to enough defense to make it 42) If buffs were on a flat multiplication system (1.75x armor, then 1.75x that armor) the second increase would be *much* larger. But it's not!

So, my next train of thought was to figure out HOW much defense was being added. Logically, I figured that it would be 1.75x my Rebecca's 381 defense. However, Then she would gain 285.75 defense and 57.15 healing. She's gained 41, which is much less than that.

My next thought was that something must not be counted. Therefore, I tried neglecting her +105 defense item. This means she'd be gaining 276 x 0.75 = 207 defense. Knowing that defense provides a 20% benefit on aoe heals, it should add 41.4 healing.

Eureka! There's your answer :P

The fact that the second buff adds 41 healing on the dot as well verifies that what the system is doing is taking your base, itemless stat, calculating, and then adding that number every time. Having one or two or whatever buffs already does not factor in to the amount added. This also means that buffs are *additive*

And there you have it!

I'm not sure what the system does with decimal places at the moment. In this case it was 41.4 so even adding twice it doesn't reach another number. If it was say, 41.6, I have no idea what it would do with the decimal place without some testing. They could potentially round up to 42 and add both times for 84 total, or ignore the decimal and add 41 each time for 82 total, or even carry a hidden decimal and add 41 THEN 42 after the .6 and .6 add. We'd need more testing (also I'm referring to healing as defense by accident xD) I think it carries a hidden decimal place and then adds it as a whole once it's over 1 but I'm not sure.

Debuffs: I'm not 100% sure of this because it hasn't been tested but I assume they work the same way.

Let's assume Pintarus' attack was 1000. Your debuff reduced it by 40%. That's 400 attack reduced. The first debuff reduced it to 600, then 200, and then the rest of the debuffs did nothing. Of course this is assuming debuffs work how buffs do but I don't see why they wouldn't. What this means is that buffs and debuffs are

Theoretically, this means that if you apply 2x 55% armor debuffs that the target *should* be at 0 armor. Some testing to confirm would be nice though!

If someone that actually has a 55%- armor debuff could help me test it would be great. Just take note of a skills damage (single hit skill will be easier to track) with no armor debuffs. Put up one, do a few tests with that. Put up 2, test again. IF it indeed adds like this, buff 1 should add slightly more damage than buff 2, since it's impossible to reduce armor past 0. So technically, let's say Pintarus has 1000 def. Debuff 1 reduces to by 550 to 450, while debuff 2 can only reduce from 450 to 0. So the damage difference between 0 debuffs and 1 debuff should be greater than the difference between 1 and 2.

Can someone that has a rocket king toad test this for me please? I unfortunately don't.

Another question left unanswered here is which buffs stack and which don't. For example Bo has a -30 and a -25% armor debuff. Can you have two of each? If so, 60%+50% = 0 armor target. If they don't stack though, then the 30% will override the 25% and only the stronger ones will count so 60% - therefore there's no need to cast his second -armor skill if you don't want to and no reason to bring multiple -armors.

Anyway, let's keep this thread going and do more testing to figure stuff out There's still a lot we don't know.

We know already from testing that for AoE healing the buff adds 20% of defense as healing.

So, let's take my +5 and +5 lak and do some testing, shall we?!

I'll give you guys the correct answer ahead of time and then show my work - here is the punchline, so to speak.

**Buffs are calculated based off of itemless stats and do not include items or other buffs. They are calculated as a flat value and then added to the old value. Upgrades, however, are calculated in. The second buff will add precisely the same amount as the first.**First thing to test is to do heals with 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc buffs.

Rebecca heal with x buffs

0 buffs = 218

1 buff = 259

2 buffs = 300

3 buffs = 342

Another interesting thing to notice is that EVERY TIME the healing is increased by *exactly* 41 (well, 42 the third time but that's decimal point carryover or just the extra 285.75 armor adding up to enough defense to make it 42) If buffs were on a flat multiplication system (1.75x armor, then 1.75x that armor) the second increase would be *much* larger. But it's not!

So, my next train of thought was to figure out HOW much defense was being added. Logically, I figured that it would be 1.75x my Rebecca's 381 defense. However, Then she would gain 285.75 defense and 57.15 healing. She's gained 41, which is much less than that.

My next thought was that something must not be counted. Therefore, I tried neglecting her +105 defense item. This means she'd be gaining 276 x 0.75 = 207 defense. Knowing that defense provides a 20% benefit on aoe heals, it should add 41.4 healing.

Eureka! There's your answer :P

The fact that the second buff adds 41 healing on the dot as well verifies that what the system is doing is taking your base, itemless stat, calculating, and then adding that number every time. Having one or two or whatever buffs already does not factor in to the amount added. This also means that buffs are *additive*

And there you have it!

I'm not sure what the system does with decimal places at the moment. In this case it was 41.4 so even adding twice it doesn't reach another number. If it was say, 41.6, I have no idea what it would do with the decimal place without some testing. They could potentially round up to 42 and add both times for 84 total, or ignore the decimal and add 41 each time for 82 total, or even carry a hidden decimal and add 41 THEN 42 after the .6 and .6 add. We'd need more testing (also I'm referring to healing as defense by accident xD) I think it carries a hidden decimal place and then adds it as a whole once it's over 1 but I'm not sure.

Debuffs: I'm not 100% sure of this because it hasn't been tested but I assume they work the same way.

Let's assume Pintarus' attack was 1000. Your debuff reduced it by 40%. That's 400 attack reduced. The first debuff reduced it to 600, then 200, and then the rest of the debuffs did nothing. Of course this is assuming debuffs work how buffs do but I don't see why they wouldn't. What this means is that buffs and debuffs are

**additive.**Theoretically, this means that if you apply 2x 55% armor debuffs that the target *should* be at 0 armor. Some testing to confirm would be nice though!

If someone that actually has a 55%- armor debuff could help me test it would be great. Just take note of a skills damage (single hit skill will be easier to track) with no armor debuffs. Put up one, do a few tests with that. Put up 2, test again. IF it indeed adds like this, buff 1 should add slightly more damage than buff 2, since it's impossible to reduce armor past 0. So technically, let's say Pintarus has 1000 def. Debuff 1 reduces to by 550 to 450, while debuff 2 can only reduce from 450 to 0. So the damage difference between 0 debuffs and 1 debuff should be greater than the difference between 1 and 2.

Can someone that has a rocket king toad test this for me please? I unfortunately don't.

Another question left unanswered here is which buffs stack and which don't. For example Bo has a -30 and a -25% armor debuff. Can you have two of each? If so, 60%+50% = 0 armor target. If they don't stack though, then the 30% will override the 25% and only the stronger ones will count so 60% - therefore there's no need to cast his second -armor skill if you don't want to and no reason to bring multiple -armors.

Anyway, let's keep this thread going and do more testing to figure stuff out There's still a lot we don't know.

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